I feel like 11-year olds Ron, Harry, and Hermione would have this conversation
Agreed. This is the golden trio as children.
I feel like 11-year olds Ron, Harry, and Hermione would have this conversation
Agreed. This is the golden trio as children.
Ron: It’s really weird that we have to learn magical theory. I mean, it’s magic, innit? It’s not really possible to enforce rules on it.
Hermione: Everything has rules, Ron. Even magic; just look at Gamp’s Laws of Elemental Transfiguration.
Ron: You mean including the food one I broke back in second year when my wand backfired?
Hermione: …
Hermione: I need to go and rethink my entire life.
So this is inspired partially by this thread, but it’s enough of a digression that it warrants its own thing.
Quick background: I’m a teacher. Any teacher worth their salt will tell you that grades don’t measure intelligence. Lack of intelligence can prevent getting good grades, but it’s definitely not the only factor.
We see the members of the Golden Trio doing lots of magic. We should take what we actually see them doing to be the most accurate representation of their actual skill in magic–which means we can compare their skills to their OWL marks to see what OWL marks actually represent.
Harry has an O (Outstanding) in Defense, and E (Exceeds Expectations) in Charms and Transfiguration.
Hermione has an E in Defense, and O in Charms and Transfiguration.
We’re never told Ron’s exact marks, but we can infer that he has an E in each of Defense, Charms, and Transfiguration based on the fact that he didn’t have any Os, but he was allowed to continue at NEWT in all three of these subjects.
What do we know about the three characters’ magical abilities?
Well, first of all, they’re all pretty good at actually doing magic. When any of them struggles with a spell, it’s Big News. Hermione is talented in an academic setting but occasionally chokes under pressure. Harry is also pretty good at magic but has a low frustration threshold: when he can’t immediately grasp a spell, he tends to beat himself up in nonproductive ways. Ron seems to be the best all-around spell caster, whose main fault seems to be sometimes putting too much force behind a spell.
It seems like “good at magic” is what it takes to get an E at OWL. The question becomes, what puts Harry over the top in DADA, and Hermione in Charms and Transfiguration?
It’s pretty clear that the answer is magical theory. The OWL exams clearly weight magical theory very highly. There is, after all, a substantial written portion. Neville, who (though I love my boy) we can all admit is pretty much pants at spell casting, got an E in Charms and actually passed Transfiguration. The only excuse for this is spectacular performance on the written section. We can back this up by Umbridge’s claim that the DADA class would be able to achieve passing marks having only memorized theory.
This would explain the trio’s OWL marks very well.
Hermione is the one of the three most invested in magical theory. She loves that stuff, it fascinates her. Hermione reads magical theory in her free time. She designs magical artifacts (the DA coins, the cursed parchment). And she’s articulate in explaining it, and good at writing essays. Her low DADA mark reflects her weakness in emotional magic (the Dark Arts are clearly emotional magics) and her tendency to choke under pressure: Hermione produced a written paper that deserved an O if it hadn’t been accompanied by her performance on the practical.
Harry absorbs some theory in general, but he’s spent the year before OWLs literally teaching DADA, a subject in which he has an intense interest anyway. DADA is Harry’s subject, it interests him (even disregarding the whole “dark wizard wants to kill me” thing), and he reads about it. While Harry might be haphazard on the theory of Charms and Transfiguration, he can absolutely write an insightful essay on the theory of Defense.
As for Ron? His intuitive grasp of magic works against him here. Ron doesn’t need to read six books on the theory of summoning charms; you wave your wand, you say Accio, and you make sure it doesn’t hit you in the face if it was something heavy. OWL examiners don’t want you to write that on your exam paper, though, so no Outstanding for Ron. Again, Ron has an intuition into these principles, but he hasn’t learned to clearly articulate them for the benefit of examiners.
So let’s dispell the idea that Hermione’s nine Os at OWL mean that she’s “better at magic” than the boys. She has a more articulate grasp of the theory of magic, and that’s a big part of what OWLs measure.
I’ve always liked Ron’s down-to-earth approach to magic. Like, he’s not going to be asking whether something’s an imprint of a departed soul; he’s just gonna get on with things. And if push comes to shove, he can always throw his wand away and punch the offending person in the face.
It’s weird like I appreciate this so much, considering how nerdy I am in real life. Not to mention the fact that I have a Masters in History, and even I think that History of Magic is boring. It’s like Harry says, the subject is actually quite interesting, but Binns isn’t the best teacher (no doubt Rowling made it that way so that she wouldn’t have to put too much thought into the actual history of Magical Britain).
The fandom perception that Ron only passed his Hogwarts classes due to Hermione is messed-up.
Ron has almost exactly the same grades as Harry throughout the entire series (aside from DATDA), and he was passed all but two of his O.W.Ls with decent marks. Realistically speaking, the only class Ron (and Harry) had difficulty taking notes for was History of Magic, and even then Hermione is literally the only person in their year group able to stay focused during Binn’s classes.
Ron and Harry are both typical teenagers who dislike school-work, but still work hard when it comes to the crunch. Implying that they both only passed their exams due to Hermione is doing them an injustice. Yes, she did help them out occasionally (she is their friend, after all), but she didn’t take their exams for them.
I swear, if I see one more post about Hermione gloating over Ron’s supposed lack of academic skill, I swear to Merlin…
Right? Like, Hermione does help them, of course she does. And Harry and Ron both occasionally express the sentiment that they would never pass without her… but they’re expressing gratitude for her help, not describing reality.
Do they both get better marks for Hermione helping them study? Yeah, probably. As in, they both learn more because they study with Hermione, whose company keeps them engaged when they might have done something else if left to their own devices. Sure. In Hermione’s absence, I’d honestly expect that to be more of a problem for Harry than for Ron, simply because Harry has less incentive to get good grades than Ron does.
(I actually don’t like the assumption that Ron and Harry’s marks were identical outside Harry’s Defense score. We know they’re on par, and can make certain inferences about Ron’s OWL scores, but there’s nothing to exclude Ron having, e.g., passed History but failed Astronomy. I like to think there were little differences like that.)
Exactly. Yes, Hermione does help them out, which does help their chances, but she’s hardly the sole reason for them both passing their classes.
Ron definitely has more incentive to work harder than Harry does. Harry doesn’t really have to worry about the Dursley’s reactions to his grades, but Ron has to deal with the expectations of being a Weasley. All of his siblings (bar Fred and George) achieved higher-than-average grades. Ron finds it difficult to stand out from his brothers, but he also doesn’t want to disappoint his parents with bad grades. Surely this would have impacted on his grades at least a little. But no; he still gets almost exactly the same grades as Harry. It’s baffling.
I remember, earlier today, I saw an artwork where Hermione basically implied that Ron couldn’t pass his classes without her. It really infuriates me just how many in the fandom have taken on the ‘Hermione is brilliant at everything and the only reason anyone did anything good in the HP series’ attitude.
Y’all….Hermione wasn’t (and isn’t) perfect. She may be academically smart, but there’s only so much you can do with that. Hermione said it herself in PS/SS; there are more important things.
I also find it annoying how Ron and Harry got the exact same scores except for Harry’s higher grade in DATDA. I mean, Harry passed out during the History of Magic exam, and yet he still gets the same grade as Ron (who sat the whole thing). Ron’s no slouch when it comes to studying, and he has the advantage of having grown up in the wizarding world (meaning he would have known little trivia bits that Harry wouldn’t have). Why did he fail as well? He was even using the same notes that Hermione was using to revise. It really confuses me.
Considering his powerful non-verbal magic (often involving Charms and Transfiguration), you’d think Ron would excel in those subjects. Also, wouldn’t it have been awesome if Ron had (just once) gotten a higher grade than Hermione in a subject? Would that be too much to ask?
People who say Hermione needs someone who is her intellectual equal. I mean WTF!!
Hermione never cared for brilliance or excellence. If she did, she would have fallen for a ravenclaw. She loved Ron because she spent lots of time with him, she watched him grow, she understood him, she knew him. She loved him without any particular reason. It was so natural so spontaneous it was as if they were destined to be together. They fought like husband and wife before they even started dating. Hermione wasn’t an over-ambitious bitch. If she was, she’d be a Slytherin. Nor did she cared for smartness or intellect that much. If that was the case she’d be a Ravenclaw. No, she was a Gryffindor. A brave, adventurous, lion hearted Gryffindor who valued friendship and bravery above anything else. And Ron was good at both. He was a good friend. He was brave. He was loyal. And he was just perfect for her.
Foundation of a relationship needs LOVE, trust, respect and understanding. Not IQ.
Besides Ron defeated Mcgonagall at chess at the age of 12.
Got more O.W.Ls than Fred George combined without studying properly.
Could produce a corporeal patronus at the age of 15 when many grown up wizards and witches struggled with it.
Even Tonks a qualified auror was impressed with his skills.
He could cast nonverbal spells easily.
He became an auror after the war.
He was more than enough to stimulate her intellectually. Thank you so much.
I’m sure he was also enough to stimulate her in… other areas 😏
This post went from ‘Ron is amazing and smart’ to ‘Ron is also great in bed’ in about five seconds.
the older i get the more it’s clear that being smart doesn’t get you very far if you’re not disciplined. there are tons of people who are brilliant but not disciplined. they have amazing ideas but cannot finish a project. they are creative and innovative but cannot execute a plan. i see how important it is to set deadlines and boundaries for myself an to be disciplined.
Hufflepuffs- teach us your ways.
Well, if you insist…
Here are my top tips as a Hufflepuff for getting things done;
Hope those help!
You don’t know me until you stayed up till 4 A.M with me
And drunk
Ima tell you what 4 am/drunk hillary is like:
I will be singing songs (and most of them will be broadway or disney- like I can and will perform ALL of les mis/rent/wicked/thesecretgarden/heathers/jesuschristsuperstar/cabaret/chicago/phantom/westsidestory/chorusline/sweeneytodd/intothewoods/hamilton/beautyandthebeast/lionking- most disney movies)
or
debating/discussing politics/issues – typically ‘radically leftist/sjw/feminist/environmental/immigrant’ issues
or
have a deep-ass conversation about life- like the deep shit about relationships, family, personality, approaches to trauma
or
rambling/ranting about some fandom shit- most likely harry potter- but I am into a ton of other stuff.
or
Talking about my dog/husband as I am obsessed with both.
A lot of the time it’s some sort of combo of multitudes of these- where we sing some les mis together- then I rant about how modern day usa ain’t much better than paris in the 1832 when it comes to the lives of the working class- then I rant about the movie version of it- then drunkenly sing out the incorrect lyrics ♪ ♫
LOVELY LADIES, SMELL EM IN THE AIR!
♪ ♫
I just start giggling on the rare occasion where I am tipsy. Wish I was as enthusiastic as you are, @hillnerd
all i can think watching the second to last scene is let harry and ron hold hands, hermione doesn’t have to be in the middle
Is Hollywood really that terrified of boys holding hands platonically?
(I personally also put it down to Steve Kloves trying to push in some H*rmione-baiting even after Ron and Hermione got together, but that’s probably just me)